{"id":112438,"date":"2025-03-05T15:56:49","date_gmt":"2025-03-05T20:56:49","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/?p=112438"},"modified":"2025-03-06T13:00:01","modified_gmt":"2025-03-06T18:00:01","slug":"feature-university-toronto-talk-focuses-preparing-music-artists-ai-dominated-industry","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/2025\/03\/05\/feature-university-toronto-talk-focuses-preparing-music-artists-ai-dominated-industry\/","title":{"rendered":"FEATURE | University Of Toronto Talk Focuses On Preparing Music Artists For An AI-Dominated Industry"},"content":{"rendered":"<figure id=\"attachment_112440\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-112440\" style=\"width: 1200px\" class=\"wp-caption aligncenter\"><img decoding=\"async\" loading=\"lazy\" class=\"size-full wp-image-112440\" src=\"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2025\/03\/Copy-of-Copy-of-INTERVIEW-2025-03-05T155554.064.jpg\" alt=\"R-L: DJ, producer, vocalist Vanese VJ Smith\/Pursuit Grooves; Ambient musician &amp; producer Daniel Field (Photos courtesy of the artists)\" width=\"1200\" height=\"628\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2025\/03\/Copy-of-Copy-of-INTERVIEW-2025-03-05T155554.064.jpg 1200w, https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2025\/03\/Copy-of-Copy-of-INTERVIEW-2025-03-05T155554.064-300x157.jpg 300w, https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2025\/03\/Copy-of-Copy-of-INTERVIEW-2025-03-05T155554.064-1024x536.jpg 1024w, https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2025\/03\/Copy-of-Copy-of-INTERVIEW-2025-03-05T155554.064-768x402.jpg 768w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 1200px) 100vw, 1200px\" \/><figcaption id=\"caption-attachment-112440\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">R-L: DJ, producer, vocalist Vanese VJ Smith\/Pursuit Grooves; Ambient musician &amp; producer Daniel Field (Photos courtesy of the artists)<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n<p>Making a living as a musician, especially an independent artist, is extraordinarily difficult. Add artificial intelligence and its broad influence on the music industry, and it becomes even harder to navigate.<\/p>\n<p>The University of Toronto recently hosted a panel discussion on the topic with a focus on indie artists. The goal is to turn out grads who can function in today\u2019s music environment.<\/p>\n<p>The panel discussions and talks, presented as part of the Toronto Music Entrepreneurship Exchange, more broadly, part of University of Toronto Entrepreneurship Week, and covered the way AI affects everything from algorithm-driven streaming to artistic ownership.<\/p>\n<h2>The Initiative<\/h2>\n<p><strong>Ely Lyonblum<\/strong> is a Strategic Research Development Officer at UofT\u2019s Faculty of Music, and he set up the panel discussion as part of his role.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cWe have that role in each division across the university,\u201d he explains. As a Strategic Research Development Officer, he\u2019s embedded within the music department, where he gets to know the faculty, students, and how to support them and their research in creative ways.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI have the luxury, the privilege and the joy of really being able to connect with students and educators.\u201d At the same time, he can compare notes and coordinate with his peers in other departments if needed.<\/p>\n<p>Lyonblum completed his own Doctorate in Music a few years ago. He recalls hearing a lot of conversations around the notion of music entrepreneurship. An indie artist has to think like a business person, and understand the environment they work in. As he points out, even for purely academic purposes, understanding the way the industry works is key.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI wanted to make sure that knowledge was shared as widely as possible.\u201d He says the students learn practical skills. \u201cI see the work that we\u2019re doing as very complementary.\u201d Along with a graduate seminar, Ely routinely connects with professors to help amplify what they want to convey to their students.<\/p>\n<p>AI isn\u2019t a compulsory part of any music program, but as he points out, it enters into everything from music creation through text or music generation, or the way it is used by streaming music services to expose specific tracks through recommendations.<\/p>\n<h3>Spotify: How AI Suggests New Music<\/h3>\n<p>On streaming services like Spotify, AI models create the recommendations that point users to their next favourite music, podcasts, or other content.<\/p>\n<p>An algorithm makes predictions based on the data it gathers on a user\u2019s behaviour and preferences. That data is compared with other users with similar profiles. It can also base its recommendations on the characteristics of the music itself; i.e. it looks at the specs of a track you like or save, and finds others with similar elements.<\/p>\n<p>Spotify\u2019s algorithms use a hybrid approach that should consider both aspects, i.e. user history and the specific songs streamed.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cThere are so many ways they will encounter it,\u201d Lyonblum says. He feels it\u2019s an important part of music industry literacy in the 21st century. \u201cWe don\u2019t want there to be a sense of unfounded fear.\u201d There are real concerns about replacing composers with AI, and other issues, he acknowledges. \u201cBut, we want to give our students as much knowledge about where those concerns comer from.\u201d<\/p>\n<div class=\"jetpack-video-wrapper\"><span class=\"embed-youtube\" style=\"text-align:center; display: block;\"><iframe loading=\"lazy\" class=\"youtube-player\" width=\"640\" height=\"360\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/EGshyFWi5a0?version=3&#038;rel=1&#038;showsearch=0&#038;showinfo=1&#038;iv_load_policy=1&#038;fs=1&#038;hl=en-US&#038;autohide=2&#038;wmode=transparent\" allowfullscreen=\"true\" style=\"border:0;\" sandbox=\"allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-popups allow-presentation\"><\/iframe><\/span><\/div>\n<h3>Working With The Algorithms<\/h3>\n<p><strong>Daniel Field<\/strong> is an independent musician with an ambient music label called Imaginary North. He records music under the name Kilometre Club, and he currently counts more than 120K monthly listeners on Spotify, with his biggest track as more than 1.8 million streams.<\/p>\n<p>Figuring out how to use the algorithms in his favour led to a big part of his current \u2014 and unexpected \u2014 success.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cMy context is, I\u2019m currently a middle school teacher,\u201d he says. Since he was a child singing folk songs, he\u2019s also worked as a musician on a casual and part-time basis. \u201cI enjoyed the recreation of being a musician.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>The slowdown of the pandemic led to learning about synthesizers, and branching into ambient music. It also led to a sense of real opportunity. \u201cI never really tried in a meaningful way,\u201d he says of his musical ambitions up to that point. As he delved into the genre, though, it changed his mind about what was possible. \u201cThere was an obvious, and growing, niche in ambient music,\u201d he says.<\/p>\n<p>Producing and recording music is now possible with a synth and a laptop; finding listeners is the real trick. He says he approached it from the \u201cstandpoint of knowing nothing\u201d.<\/p>\n<p>Like any other indie artist, he searched for ways to attract the attention of those Spotify algorithms. \u201cThey have an algorithm built in, [so] how do you find yourself in the flow of the water?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Daniel tried different approaches, and found that the details really matter. From trial and error he says he discovered, for instance, that ambient tracks with drum beats tended to get fewer streams. Add a few bird sounds, however, and the opposite effect seemed to come into play.<\/p>\n<p>If you can find a way, do you simply go with that flow? \u201cDo you need to kind of risk your own artistic integrity to placate the algorithms?\u201d he wondered. From the creator\u2019s standpoint, do you conform to what seems to feed the algorithm what it wants?<\/p>\n<p>As he points out, it raises other issues. The algorithms and playlists tend to group tracks according to their feel or vibe, rather than targeting specific artists.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cYou\u2019re still essentially anonymous,\u201d he says. \u201cThey\u2019re turning music into vibes.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Playing only to what works also takes a creative edge out of the music. \u201cIt\u2019s kind of softening all music,\u201d he says. \u201cAre you offering a vibe? Or are you offering an experience?\u201d Younger listeners, he mentions, often tend to listen to specific genres \u2014 not the artists themselves.<\/p>\n<p>Artists looking for recognition in their own right, rather than simply ears to listen to their tracks, need a completely different approach.<\/p>\n<p>Daniel notes that streaming services aren\u2019t music companies. \u201cThey\u2019re in the world of selling advertising,\u201d he says. \u201cIt\u2019s also adding to the difficulty.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>When it comes to ambient music production, Field points out, the distinction between AI and composer can be blurred from the outset. \u201cWhat happens when you use an arpeggiator or chord randomizer \u2014 technically, that\u2019s also AI,\u201d he says. \u201cWhere is the line drawn? I would argue, even if you went back to the 80s when they first had randomizers and arpeggiators [&#8230;] do we call that AI?\u201d<\/p>\n<p>AI generated music is a far more complex issue that it may seem.<\/p>\n<p>Success in the world of ambient music has changed his life. These day\u2019s teaching and music are both part-time.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cWere seeing the term AI as the poor man\u2019s [&#8230;] laziness,\u201d he says, \u201cbut even Garage Band has presets.\u201d<\/p>\n<div class=\"jetpack-video-wrapper\"><span class=\"embed-youtube\" style=\"text-align:center; display: block;\"><iframe loading=\"lazy\" class=\"youtube-player\" width=\"640\" height=\"360\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/gyulcac8dV4?version=3&#038;rel=1&#038;showsearch=0&#038;showinfo=1&#038;iv_load_policy=1&#038;fs=1&#038;hl=en-US&#038;autohide=2&#038;wmode=transparent\" allowfullscreen=\"true\" style=\"border:0;\" sandbox=\"allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-popups allow-presentation\"><\/iframe><\/span><\/div>\n<h3>Is More Better? And&#8230; Who\u2019s In Charge?<\/h3>\n<p><strong>Vanese VJ Smith<\/strong> is the co-founder of Loop Sessions Toronto. Part of an international organization, it works to support music production and education, with a focus on vinyl record culture. As Pursuit Grooves, Vanese has performed as a DJ and electronic music creator for two decades, and mentored students through Toronto Metropolitan University, Artscape, Canadian Music Centre, Small World Music, and Disney, among other prominent organizations.<\/p>\n<p>Loop Sessions Toronto organizes monthly events around music culture, production and creativity. \u201cWe started in 2019,\u201d Varese says. The program has grown and expanded post-pandemic.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI am myself a creative.\u201d Smith is a music producer and sound artist, and her opinions are rooted in history. She works in the community as well as academia.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI\u2019ve been very observant of particular ways in which we \u2014 especially in the creative sector \u2014 are affected by technology.\u201d Different generations also approach it differently. \u201cI\u2019m also clear that someone half my age, the way they engage with technology is very present.\u201d They can\u2019t compare before and after, in other words.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI can\u2019t speak as to algorithm as a community, because we all come from different places,\u201d she says.<\/p>\n<p>She talks about her own approach to using and teaching about technology in music creation. \u201cMy approach to mentorship and to education is very much geared towards the individual using art as self expression,\u201d she begins. It\u2019s about encouraging authenticity, and ways to maximize limitations. \u201cMaximize what you have to push your creativity until it doesn\u2019t work for you anymore \u2014 before you move along to the next thing,\u201d she explains.<\/p>\n<p>Using AI generated options from the outset can present a different sort of problem: too many options. \u201cIt\u2019s like going to a restaurant when you have 2,000 things on the menu,\u201d she says. \u201cIt seems better, but is it more creative?\u201d she asks.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI come from a background where I started with very simple gear,\u201d she says. Limitations force more creative thinking.<\/p>\n<p>Working with algorithms for music exposure can be a tricky proposition. \u201cSpotify is one of those strange, strange, strange things, because you\u2019re talking about the consumer vs. the artist,\u201d Vanese points out. It offers consumers endless choice, and artists&#8230; fewer and fewer means of making money from it.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cThis is an industry that has never supported an active living wage for its workers,\u201d she says. \u201cHow we discover things has become very streamlined. All of these questions really depend on what side of the fence you sit on,\u201d she adds.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cI definitely have more questions from the artistic perspective,\u201d Smith says.<\/p>\n<p>\u201cIt would be nice if there were more artists in control of these initiatives.\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong><em>Are you looking to promote an <a href=\"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/advertising\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><span style=\"color: #0e101a\"><u>event<\/u><\/span><\/a>? Have a\u00a0<a href=\"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/masthead\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><u>news tip<\/u><\/a>? 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Add artificial intelligence and its broad influence on the music industry, and it becomes even harder to navigate. The University of Toronto recently hosted a panel discussion on the topic with a focus on indie artists. The goal is to turn out [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":64,"featured_media":112440,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"om_disable_all_campaigns":false,"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false},"categories":[41660,22,4967,39646,61,63],"tags":[41803,25904,41802,39941],"yst_prominent_words":[25867,6616,7081,25877,20699,7549],"acf":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/2\/2025\/03\/Copy-of-Copy-of-INTERVIEW-2025-03-05T155554.064.jpg","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_shortlink":"https:\/\/wp.me\/p9bakr-tfw","amp_enabled":true,"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/112438"}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/64"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=112438"}],"version-history":[{"count":10,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/112438\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":112457,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/112438\/revisions\/112457"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/112440"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=112438"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=112438"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=112438"},{"taxonomy":"yst_prominent_words","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.ludwig-van.com\/toronto\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/yst_prominent_words?post=112438"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}